Life is complex isn’t it? Ironically, the non-child related questions at the end of your piece can be a bit daunting for those of us who have given so much to our families - there is an opportunity cost. Kid-free, I would have had a completely different career. I’m trying to figure it out now with limitations, now that I have three teens who still need me, but are more independent. I was lucky to have had the choice, and ended up with a great family. These days, I completely understand why more women choose to not bring a child into the world (and like Aniston, often it isn’t a choice). There are many ways to have fulfilling lives.
I hear you Jen, I think though with those questions you could answer them with child based answers. There's nothing stopping you saying that the thing you are most proud of is raising your kids, or what lights you up is your kids. But the way the questions don't centre on kids accommodates those who don't have kids. Does this make sense?
This whole piece is so true. It makes me grit my teeth because it's tired and it's still happening. Childless women, especially the ones who wanted, are treated like a glitch. A problem to be solved or a tragedy to be pitied. Either way, we’re dehumanized. Prodded like a failed vending machine. Thank you for writing and sharing it.
Thank you for writing/re-posting this piece. As a male, I claim No authority to fully appreciate the full import of this issue. I myself made the decision early in life to forego having children - for me personally, the most self aware decision I ever made. I can think of no choice in life more sacred and consequential than the solemn decision to have or not to have children. Seems to me that real empowerment IS freedom to make reproductive choices.
I so so so deeply appreciate your input on this. I think while women get the bulk of pronatalist bull shit, men don't escape it's teeth. I think you are right, it is absolutely the most scared and consequential decision. Perfect words for such a huge decision.
Ali! Your perspective on society’s obsession with women’s requirement to have children or get married for that matter, is spot on. I have observed numerous women with their screaming, or about to be screaming children - and there is no way in hell they should remotely be “mothers, its all nonsensical BS, a fallacy foisted on us by the patriarchy.
Thank you for this. I’m so glad to now be at an age when I’ve finally stopped being asked, or told ‘oh that’s a shame, you’d have made a great mum’ which is somehow worse. I think the younger generation know not to ask, so things are slowly changing. Let’s hope so.🤞
I feel we are both in the middle ground. The time period where the questions abate. Allowing us time to breath before questions about grandkids and conversations around grandkids slam dunk us 🤣
Thanks Zoe - do you get asked about whether you have grandkids now? Or maybe people even presume you do. I've been told that's what I've got to look forward to.
LOVE your suggestions for alternative questions! Wish I'd had them in my back pocket a couple of decades ago -- and it's not too late to employ them now. Thanks for this insightful article.
Thanks Kathleen. I just feel there's always other things we can talk about. But for some reason kids have become the default. Do we really lack the imagination to instigate interesting conversation? :-)
My nearly grown daughters are the very best part of my life💕 & in the near future I get to look forward to grands, or if I am so fortunate I’ll have a third late in life baby which would make me over the moon. I do not need me time, my isolating job of travel was fun for the past 3 years but I’d just be a shell of a human if it weren’t for my girls. Carry on tho how anyone else sees fit 😘
As a woman with no children, I think it is a fool’s errand to expect people to alter normal social interactions to accommodate my feelings and experiences, which are outliers, and always will be. Most people have kids! Most people want to talk about having kids! Making peace with disappointment is part of life. My complicated feelings about the path my life has taken are always with me—they don’t disappear just because no one has spoken the words out loud for a while. A random question doesn’t summon them forth like a genie from a bottle. I don’t believe that my cats and my crafting class are just as worthy and noble and interesting as bringing new life into the world, and neither does anyone else!
Over the years; this script has served me well. Q: Do you have kids? Me: No. Q: Why not/do you want them/when are you going to start trying for kids ? Me: (Shrug and half smile) It just wasn’t in the cards. No one has ever asked a single follow up question in response to that answer, and we go on to talk about the topic they really wanted to bring up in the first place: their kids. Problem solved. They get to share stories about their kids to their heart’s content, and I am spared from having to tell a stranger at a dinner party about “what fills my time.”
“Do you have kids?” Is a normal small talk question. It is not rude to ask this question. People with complicated feelings about the topic should learn how to gracefully deal with this inquiry when it inevitably comes up.
“Why don’t you have kids?” Or “Do you want kids?” Is a question best asked within close relationships and not to strangers at cocktail parties.
Oh I’m so sorry this is how you feel you have to live. You are allowed to take up space in this world too; you don’t have to think your pets and crafts are the same as babies to be proud of them and talk about them, it’s not a competition of self worth. You are also allowed to set boundaries, you can contribute more than a shrug to a conversation, and you are not held hostage to listening to other people talking about their kids because that’s all they care about. Especially because people who can only talk about their kids are so sad and boring!
Don’t worry about me, I have good friends who share my interests and we talk a lot about my life, and their lives, and everything that is on our minds whenever we make time to see each other. I take up plenty of space with them.
However, I don’t have the kind of life that makes for very interesting small talk at parties or at the dentist’s office (for many reasons beyond just not having kids), so small talk situations are for listening. That’s not some grand sacrifice, that’s hard won acceptance.
FWIW, these social rituals where parents seek and give support to other parents are important, they’re about more than my feelings, and they’re not going away. It is wiser to put on your boots than to try and carpet the world.
“these social rituals where parents seek and give support to other parents are important”
I totally agree! But the key words are “other parents.” I don’t mind the question, and I don’t mind sharing that I’m childless not by choice if I need to. But if someone continues to talk at me about their kids and that’s it, I don’t feel like I need to absorb that, but that’s what I need to stake my place in the world. My go to phrase is “I’m not the target audience for this.” It’s pretty rare that I come across someone so socially inept, but it makes me feel better knowing I have power and agency. If you don’t need that, and it sounds like you don’t, then that’s great!
Brilliant piece Ali! Here I was trying to give it 50 claps!
That's it in the end - if it doesn't come up, just don't ask. It's really that simple. Why jump right in with something so personal? Makes no sense...
Thanks Maria :-) Totally, if the topic is brought up, it's a green light to discuss. If it's not, just don't.
I’d argue that women with a spouse and kids are often less complete. It wasn’t until I got married, then had children, that I started to disappear.
I’ve heard that from several friends. I hope you find your way back to yourself :-)
Life is complex isn’t it? Ironically, the non-child related questions at the end of your piece can be a bit daunting for those of us who have given so much to our families - there is an opportunity cost. Kid-free, I would have had a completely different career. I’m trying to figure it out now with limitations, now that I have three teens who still need me, but are more independent. I was lucky to have had the choice, and ended up with a great family. These days, I completely understand why more women choose to not bring a child into the world (and like Aniston, often it isn’t a choice). There are many ways to have fulfilling lives.
I hear you Jen, I think though with those questions you could answer them with child based answers. There's nothing stopping you saying that the thing you are most proud of is raising your kids, or what lights you up is your kids. But the way the questions don't centre on kids accommodates those who don't have kids. Does this make sense?
This whole piece is so true. It makes me grit my teeth because it's tired and it's still happening. Childless women, especially the ones who wanted, are treated like a glitch. A problem to be solved or a tragedy to be pitied. Either way, we’re dehumanized. Prodded like a failed vending machine. Thank you for writing and sharing it.
Dehumanized! YES! And prodded like a failed vending machine. I love your phraseology here. Thanks for sharing.
Thank you for writing/re-posting this piece. As a male, I claim No authority to fully appreciate the full import of this issue. I myself made the decision early in life to forego having children - for me personally, the most self aware decision I ever made. I can think of no choice in life more sacred and consequential than the solemn decision to have or not to have children. Seems to me that real empowerment IS freedom to make reproductive choices.
I so so so deeply appreciate your input on this. I think while women get the bulk of pronatalist bull shit, men don't escape it's teeth. I think you are right, it is absolutely the most scared and consequential decision. Perfect words for such a huge decision.
Ali! Your perspective on society’s obsession with women’s requirement to have children or get married for that matter, is spot on. I have observed numerous women with their screaming, or about to be screaming children - and there is no way in hell they should remotely be “mothers, its all nonsensical BS, a fallacy foisted on us by the patriarchy.
Thank you. YES - "Foistered on us by the patriarchy" - that's it!
Thank you for this. I’m so glad to now be at an age when I’ve finally stopped being asked, or told ‘oh that’s a shame, you’d have made a great mum’ which is somehow worse. I think the younger generation know not to ask, so things are slowly changing. Let’s hope so.🤞
Not yet, I’m 49, so maybe I too have that to look forward to!
I feel we are both in the middle ground. The time period where the questions abate. Allowing us time to breath before questions about grandkids and conversations around grandkids slam dunk us 🤣
Thanks Zoe - do you get asked about whether you have grandkids now? Or maybe people even presume you do. I've been told that's what I've got to look forward to.
YES, yes and YES! And oh my god what a horribly painful thing for her to go through, and she did it with so much class.
Class, that's exactly it. I just can't imagine the pain. Thanks for commenting Laura
LOVE your suggestions for alternative questions! Wish I'd had them in my back pocket a couple of decades ago -- and it's not too late to employ them now. Thanks for this insightful article.
Thanks Kathleen. I just feel there's always other things we can talk about. But for some reason kids have become the default. Do we really lack the imagination to instigate interesting conversation? :-)
My nearly grown daughters are the very best part of my life💕 & in the near future I get to look forward to grands, or if I am so fortunate I’ll have a third late in life baby which would make me over the moon. I do not need me time, my isolating job of travel was fun for the past 3 years but I’d just be a shell of a human if it weren’t for my girls. Carry on tho how anyone else sees fit 😘
As a woman with no children, I think it is a fool’s errand to expect people to alter normal social interactions to accommodate my feelings and experiences, which are outliers, and always will be. Most people have kids! Most people want to talk about having kids! Making peace with disappointment is part of life. My complicated feelings about the path my life has taken are always with me—they don’t disappear just because no one has spoken the words out loud for a while. A random question doesn’t summon them forth like a genie from a bottle. I don’t believe that my cats and my crafting class are just as worthy and noble and interesting as bringing new life into the world, and neither does anyone else!
Over the years; this script has served me well. Q: Do you have kids? Me: No. Q: Why not/do you want them/when are you going to start trying for kids ? Me: (Shrug and half smile) It just wasn’t in the cards. No one has ever asked a single follow up question in response to that answer, and we go on to talk about the topic they really wanted to bring up in the first place: their kids. Problem solved. They get to share stories about their kids to their heart’s content, and I am spared from having to tell a stranger at a dinner party about “what fills my time.”
My script is:
Q: Do you have children?
A: [in a bright up-beat tone] No, but I have a 9 year old nephew [talk a bit about nephew]. How about yourself?
Then they can tell me all about their children, without the "why not" question coming up.
A possible compromise position:
“Do you have kids?” Is a normal small talk question. It is not rude to ask this question. People with complicated feelings about the topic should learn how to gracefully deal with this inquiry when it inevitably comes up.
“Why don’t you have kids?” Or “Do you want kids?” Is a question best asked within close relationships and not to strangers at cocktail parties.
Oh I’m so sorry this is how you feel you have to live. You are allowed to take up space in this world too; you don’t have to think your pets and crafts are the same as babies to be proud of them and talk about them, it’s not a competition of self worth. You are also allowed to set boundaries, you can contribute more than a shrug to a conversation, and you are not held hostage to listening to other people talking about their kids because that’s all they care about. Especially because people who can only talk about their kids are so sad and boring!
Don’t worry about me, I have good friends who share my interests and we talk a lot about my life, and their lives, and everything that is on our minds whenever we make time to see each other. I take up plenty of space with them.
However, I don’t have the kind of life that makes for very interesting small talk at parties or at the dentist’s office (for many reasons beyond just not having kids), so small talk situations are for listening. That’s not some grand sacrifice, that’s hard won acceptance.
FWIW, these social rituals where parents seek and give support to other parents are important, they’re about more than my feelings, and they’re not going away. It is wiser to put on your boots than to try and carpet the world.
“these social rituals where parents seek and give support to other parents are important”
I totally agree! But the key words are “other parents.” I don’t mind the question, and I don’t mind sharing that I’m childless not by choice if I need to. But if someone continues to talk at me about their kids and that’s it, I don’t feel like I need to absorb that, but that’s what I need to stake my place in the world. My go to phrase is “I’m not the target audience for this.” It’s pretty rare that I come across someone so socially inept, but it makes me feel better knowing I have power and agency. If you don’t need that, and it sounds like you don’t, then that’s great!
Oh how boring the world would be if we all shared the same opinions. Thanks for taking the time to leave a comment with your thoughts.